Moscow. August 15th. INTERFAX - Since June of this year, Denis Manturov has been combining the positions of head of the Ministry of Industry and Trade of the Russian Federation and Deputy Prime Minister - curator of the civil and defense industries. In his first interview in the new status, he told Interfax in which directions Russia will develop technological sovereignty, whether there is a threat of dependence on China, what is happening with investment activity in industries, as well as the prospects for arms exports to Turkey and Iran, the timing of the development of Checkmate, PAK DA and new attack drones.
— Denis Valentinovich, your appointment to the post of Deputy Prime Minister with the combination of the minister's position, as we understand, is designed to simplify the processes of industrial transformation against the background of sanctions pressure. To what extent does the new position increase the efficiency of solving the tasks that are set before you? And what tasks do you consider to be priorities now, both operationally and strategically?
— The decision of the country's leadership to combine the two positions was made taking into account the need to increase production within the framework of the state defense order and ensure technological sovereignty in civilian industries under sanctions pressure. After passing through the most acute phase of transformations in the economy, it can be revised. Now it is necessary to increase the speed, and hence the timeliness and effectiveness of management decisions aimed at supporting industries - and at the same time ensure correct interaction between executive authorities when coordinating complex steps. Promoting the interests of industry, we need to maintain a balance with other sectors of the economy.
Therefore, we will find deliberate and compromise solutions. As an example, just the other day we discussed the issue of zero VAT on ship repair. We have found a solution in which VAT can be reset for all enterprises of the ship repair industry, but the signing of an investment agreement and the direction of additional income for the development of the enterprise will be a prerequisite. This compromise solution will help us to increase the volume of ship repair. In the future, due to the modernization of enterprises and an increase in the volume of services, budget revenues will also be provided. There are also issues related to the adjustment of the tax burden on the metallurgical industry. Here, with colleagues from the Ministry of Finance, we also found a compromise: it was considered impractical to completely abolish the excise tax on liquid steel, but at the same time we will raise the "cut-off" at a price at which the rate will be zero in the current conditions. At the same time, if the price situation changes (in the direction of price increase), additional budget revenues will be provided. Now we are completing the discussion of the adjustment, we are also working on changing the MET formula for iron ore raw materials and coking coal, which is necessary in the current conditions.
And, of course, we expect to launch an industrial mortgage mechanism in the near future, which is very much expected in the regions. Next year, an updated set of support measures (tax incentives, subsidies, product demand support) for investment projects within industrial clusters will be launched. This task was set by the President, and now we are preparing the necessary regulations.
In the medium and long term, the main "bottlenecks" have already been identified, as well as priorities for their expansion. We plan to ensure technological sovereignty by working in five strategic areas: basic industries, transport connectivity, energy security, infrastructure development for housing construction, industrial food security. Now we are forming a comprehensive system - from development to production. We develop engineering centers, stimulate R&D. In the near future, 30 advanced engineering schools will appear in 15 regions of Russia (within the framework of the federal project "Advanced Engineering Schools"). This will provide high-tech sectors of the economy with qualified specialists, as well as create breakthrough developments that will form the basis of technological sovereignty.
— What do you mean by technological sovereignty? Should it cover all areas of industry?
— The task of "covering" all spheres of industry has never been set, we have never even formulated it that way, although we are very often "asked" from this principle. I mentioned the priority areas for ensuring technological sovereignty, which we will focus on, answering the previous question - they affect various aspects of national security. But I have always said this, and I will stress it now: there will be no total rejection of the principles of a market economy. The state will be involved in the management of industries and projects precisely to the extent necessary, for example, for the speedy restoration of production chains.
— Continuing the theme of technological sovereignty, Russia is now actively developing in terms of supply chains, cooperative ties, and so on towards Asia. Does this not threaten in the future the dependence of the Russian economy on Asian partners, primarily Chinese, just as earlier in some areas we were "tied" to Western technologies and goods? Will Russia be able to maintain a balance between solving operational tasks to provide industry with equipment and strategic tasks aimed at creating its own technologies?
— The products produced in Asia are of high quality and compete not only in Russia, but in the global market as a whole. It is important to observe the interests of our country here - to prevent dependence in terms of basic industries. That is why we are not only not curtailing existing manufacturer support programs, but are expanding them and launching new ones. And on the short track, yes, with a favorable exchange rate, we are now trying to close the needs for equipment and components as soon as possible where Russian production is simply unable to meet domestic demand quickly due to a shortage of capacity.
— Western sanctions have imposed a ban on the import of aircraft and components into the Russian Federation. How much has the demand of airlines for domestic SSJ100 aircraft increased in this regard? Have there been any new potential operators of this aircraft? With which of them are substantive negotiations being conducted?
— As our new machines - Superjet-NEW and MS-21 - enter serial production, the volume of production of Tu-214 and other types of aircraft increases - here, I think, no one has any illusions anymore - the Russian domestic market will be saturated with domestic equipment. Therefore, absolutely all major Russian operators have already become its potential customers.
— Will the timing of the creation of promising military aircraft, including the PAK DA strategic bomber, be shifted due to sanctions? In particular, it was reported about the shortage of some foreign parts, for example, bearings — will this affect the pace of creation of new aircraft?
— PAK DA is a strategic aviation complex, and there is no question of using foreign parts in a project of this type. The project is being implemented in accordance with the schedule.
— At the same time, the first flight of the new Su-75 Checkmate single—engine fighter has already been postponed to a later date - what is the reason for this?
— We are talking about the creation of a new aviation complex. Deadlines are as short as possible. Now the work on the Checkmate aircraft is at the stage of preparing the production of the first prototypes. The core of the cooperation of the project are Rostec enterprises, the aircraft is created according to the modular principle with the optional implementation of elements of the avionics complex. Due to this, the Checkmate project uses the best ready-made developments implemented within the framework of the 5th generation aviation complex. The standard construction cycle of the first flight prototype is approximately 2-2.5 years. However, the Checkmate project uses modern digital technologies that significantly shorten this period.
Since the presentation of the project at MAKS-2021, feedback has been received from potential customers. Work was also carried out to optimize the cost and analyze individual technical solutions, which significantly increased competitiveness, commercial attractiveness, and also reduced technical risks when creating a domestic single-engine aircraft.
Based on these works, changes were made to the project, which adjusted the timing of the first departure. But at the same time, the principle of modularity and modern digital technologies made it possible to make these changes as soon as possible, and already in 2024 we plan to start flight tests.
— In recent years, we have heard many times about promising developments and even tests of domestic attack drones, we have seen their models and prototypes. For example, "Altius" and "Ballistics", kamikaze drones "Lancet" and "CUBE-UAV", "Sirius" and "Thunder", at the Victory Parade in 2018, Katran and Corsair attack drones were shown, it was reported about the creation of a promising combat quadcopter from the developers of "Orlan", MiG Corporation reported on the ongoing development of UAVs from 100 kg to 15 tons, Rostec announced the creation of mini-drones the size of a dragonfly. But the adoption, serial production of these drones, mass deliveries to the troops, and even more so their combat use has not yet been reported. Why?
— We are moving forward very intensively in this area. There are good results for various UAVs: airplane, helicopter, quadrocopter types, in different classes, including heavy.
Last December, the S-70 Hunter drone equipped with a flat jet nozzle was demonstrated for the first time. This aviation complex is a highly intelligent system and is capable of solving a wide range of tasks singly, in a group and together with manned aircraft.
As for the CUBE-UAV, as part of the initiative work, this drone passed state tests in December 2021.
A number of experimental UAVs of different dimensions are in development. Some of them are created by industrial enterprises on an initiative basis based on their own forecasts of market needs, some are commissioned and based on technical specifications of future operators.
If we talk about light UAVs, the Orlan-10 and Aileron-3SV systems are already being ordered in fairly large batches and are actively used in the military. For a long time and successfully conducted the production of UAV "Outpost", demanded by the Russian armed forces. The most modern version of this drone – "Outpost-R" - is implemented on the basis of subsystems of domestic production, which eliminates the impact of sanctions. In the MALE-class category, the UAV "Pacer" is already entering the troops.
In the near future, the delivery of the first high-altitude UAVs of a long duration of the Altius-RU flight is expected, and the further deployment of serial production.
Well, for a number of systems, work is still continuing in accordance with the schedule agreed with the main customer - after that, decisions will be made on the parameters of specific purchases.
— On the opening day of the international forum "Army-2022", it is impossible not to discuss the prospects of military exports, especially taking into account the new sanctions. Is it possible to say that the dollar is no longer used in arms export transactions?
— As we remember, our leading enterprises of the military-industrial complex, subjects of military-technical cooperation and credit organizations are now under a variety of sanctions as a result of a large-scale anti-Russian campaign unleashed by unfriendly states. Therefore, of course, calculations in US dollars for export arms transactions are currently kept to a minimum.
— In the current situation, are negotiations with Turkey on a new batch of S-400 continuing?
— The Republic of Turkey remains an important partner of the Russian Federation. Our states have close trade and economic relations, bilateral cooperation is actively developing in many areas, including military-technical cooperation - we continue cooperation with Turkey on the supply of the S–400 Triumph anti-aircraft missile system.
— What are the prospects for military-technical cooperation with Iran? Are there any applications from them for combat aircraft, ships, tanks and other offensive weapons?
— Military-technical cooperation with the Islamic Republic of Iran is currently developing, cooperation with Tehran in this area is carried out without any restrictions. At the same time, the Russian side is ready to discuss and sign agreements on topics of mutual interest.
— In May, Russia partially legalized parallel imports against the background of sanctions. How many goods, including the consumer segment, have been imported into the Russian Federation since that moment and what is the import potential until the end of the year? Are there any difficulties with marking parallel imports?
— I would like to note right away that there are no difficulties with labeling parallel import goods. Customs warehouses and the entire infrastructure involved in labeling imported products are operating normally. The operator of the marking system and integrators have a constantly replenishing semi-annual stock of necessary equipment and consumables, which eliminates the risks of difficulties with applying digital labeling to goods.
The legalization of parallel imports does not affect the duty of importers to label goods when imported into the country and transmit information to the labeling information system. On the contrary, labeling today is practically the only control tool that, in the conditions of the introduced exemptions and a moratorium on inspections, helps to prevent the entry of illegal products into the market.
As for the volume of imports of goods through parallel imports, almost $6.5 billion worth of products were imported during the period of operation of the mechanism. At the same time, it is quite difficult to make accurate forecasts on the volumes of parallel imports, but based on statistics for 2.5 months, the expected volume of imports of products by the end of the year may be about $ 16 billion (we assume that the average volume of imports is 2 - 2.5 billion per month).
— There is a position, first of all from the FAS, that parallel imports are necessary to maintain competition and, as a result, an incentive to improve the quality of products in the domestic market. You said that parallel imports are a temporary measure and will be canceled as soon as Russian enterprises start producing similar products. Are there any risks of returning to Soviet reality, when the absence of a market, especially for the consumer segment, led to monotony and, sometimes, to average quality of goods?
— When compiling the list of goods allowed for parallel import, a balanced approach was applied: only those products whose manufacturers stopped shipping to the Russian Federation were included, and the products of those enterprises that localized their production in the Russian Federation or resumed deliveries were not included, despite all the difficulties with international logistics.
If we are talking about the position of the FAS of Russia regarding the extension of the parallel import mechanism to all groups of goods, then, of course, there is a logic in this, which is that competition is the main incentive to improve the quality of products and reduce their cost. This is important, but we must not forget about domestic producers, who, from the point of view of price, will find it difficult to withstand the onslaught of products from large foreign manufacturers, especially during the period of zero import duties. This will affect domestic investment, job creation and budget revenues at all levels. Therefore, the approach to allowing parallel imports should be balanced so as not to harm national companies.
I would like to emphasize once again that it is for this reason that we have been working on and "bringing to mind" the corresponding list of goods for a long time, almost with jewelry precision, so that it works exactly as it should: it ensured the availability of the goods we need, but did not harm Russian and localized foreign enterprises that continue to work on the Russian market or supplies to the Russian Federation.
— How would you characterize the post-sanctions investment activity in various industries of the Russian Federation? On the one hand, companies are forced to direct their funds to solving operational tasks related, for example, to the restructuring of logistics, the search for new suppliers and sales markets. On the other hand, it has been said more than once that with limited access to global markets, many Russian investors began to look for investment opportunities in the Russian Federation.
— The situation with investments is as follows. Rosstat so far gives only statistics for the first quarter, in which the figures for the Russian economy were still very good, but the Ministry of Economic Development of Russia in May already predicted an almost 20 percent drop (in 2022).
We observe the following picture. Since the beginning of the special military operation, the impact on investment activity has been universal. Entrepreneurs really "took a break", not knowing how to react. In addition, everyone was under the influence of general shocks, such as a sharp rise in the dollar, an increase in interest rates, a fall in the stock market.
But then the situation changed very quickly – not without the help of the strengthened Russian currency. Those companies that had their own funds available very quickly appreciated the opportunities offered by the strengthened ruble. This is an opportunity to quickly and inexpensively purchase imported equipment from countries that have not joined the sanctions. To create or expand production facilities, the purpose of which is to occupy market niches that are vacated after the departure of foreign manufacturers and importers. Of course, the impact of the key rate and the weak orientation of the banking sector on the real market as a whole outweighs. But today, the basis for increasing competitiveness is being laid in the industry as a whole. It is necessary to consider the situation not in the design logic, but from the perspective of general processes in industries. That is why we are currently preparing support tools that would allow us to expand business opportunities for lending investments – first of all, this is an "industrial mortgage".
— Are you considering the introduction of new measures to support domestic producers of oil and gas equipment? How do you assess the proposals of the Union of Oil and Gas Equipment Manufacturers to introduce a preferential factoring mechanism for companies in the industry, as well as to introduce a clause in state contracts on customer guarantees for the purchase of the minimum required volume of import-substituting equipment? Earlier, the union also proposed suspending the operation of international technical standards (ISO) on the territory of the Russian Federation. How do you rate this offer? If it is adopted, how will the standardization of domestic oil and gas equipment be evaluated, and will this lead to a weakening of control over their technical characteristics?
— In addition to the existing measures of state support, work is underway to introduce additional mechanisms. For example, the mechanism for stimulating the renewal of the fleet of drilling rigs for the extraction of hydrocarbons, which has been operating since 2020, is now being updated and appropriate financing is being determined.
The preferential factoring mechanism proposed by the Union of Oil and Gas Equipment Manufacturers may be an additional measure to support the sustainable activities of our enterprises and reduce the risk of long delays in payments under contracts already executed with fuel and energy companies. At the moment, we are calculating the effects of the implementation of this measure.
As for international standardization, the current economic situation has forced us to return to the issue of the need to create a domestic system of standardization and certification. The problem of using foreign standards in our projects was previously caused by the participation of foreign licensors and contractors in these projects. In this regard, Russian manufacturers were simply forced to obtain certificates of compliance with foreign standards in order to participate in tenders.
At the same time, our test protocols were not always recognized, and therefore there was a need to test products at sites accredited by foreign institutions - this entailed both time and material costs, and affected the final cost of Russian products, reducing its competitiveness.
That is why the transition from foreign industry standardization and certification systems to domestic systems has become an important area of work today. The formation of uniform standards for equipment for the industry is possible today at the site of the Institute of Oil and Gas Technological Initiatives created by Fuel and Energy Companies in 2020, whose founders are Gazprom, Gazprom Neft, Sibur, Tatneft.
We believe that the involvement of new participants in the Russian oil and gas market in the Institute's activities will contribute to the accelerated introduction of Russian equipment, as well as reduce the costs of Russian manufacturers to undergo prequalification procedures from oil and gas companies.
— Has a decision been made on the enterprises where the production of import-substituting equipment for the needs of oil refining will be located? Which factories can be engaged in production? Or will the bet be made on export/re-export from friendly countries? What equipment is most needed now to continue the modernization program of Russian refineries?
— Russian machine-building enterprises have sufficient competencies for the production of technological equipment for the oil and gas processing industry. If we talk about licensed equipment, then such enterprises as Volgogradneftemash, Uralhimmash, Izhorskiye Zavody, ZAVKOM, CHLMZ, ZNIGO and many others are ready to produce a wide range of oil and gas equipment at their sites.
At the moment, the Ministry of Energy of Russia is forming a consolidated demand of enterprises of the fuel and energy complex, taking into account which a plan will be developed to increase the volume of production of necessary equipment, components and materials on the territory of our country.
— You have given estimates of a decrease in processing by 6% in 2022, and the largest decrease is expected in export-oriented industries, including fertilizer production, timber processing. How much has the export of fertilizers and timber decreased since the beginning of the year? What dynamics do you expect by the end of 2022? Is it possible that sanctions will weaken in some positions, as is gradually happening with fertilizers?
— The export of mineral fertilizers from January to June 2022 amounted to about 17 million tons, which is 7.2% less compared to the same period in 2021. This is primarily due to the shutdown of the Togliatti-Odessa ammonia pipeline that occurred at that time, restrictions on the transshipment of Russian fertilizers through the ports of neighboring states, refusals of foreign buyers to pay for Russian products, problems with payments. Taking into account the ongoing work through the UN, we hope to maintain stable supplies of fertilizers at a level not lower than last year.
According to the results of the first half of 2022, we see a reduction in exports in a number of key positions of the timber industry. This applies to lumber, plywood and furniture. At the same time, there is a positive trend in the export of finished products over the specified period. For example, the export of veneer increased by almost 13%, and pellets by 11%. Due to the "closure" of the European market, domestic manufacturers continue to look for alternative ways to sell their products and redirect their logistics flows to new directions. At the same time, it must be said that even before the official start of the European sanctions, companies began to experience difficulties with the sale of lumber to Europe under existing contracts due to difficulties with the payment of goods on the recipient's side. At the same time, there is a shortage of lumber on the European market today. Now we see the active dynamics of the development of lumber consumption in the domestic market, which is due to the summer construction season and the interest of Russians in individual housing construction.
— One of the programs supervised by the Ministry of Industry and Trade is the national project "International Cooperation and Export", it includes targets for increasing the share of non–primary non-energy exports to 70% of the 2020 level by 2030. To what extent are the parameters laid down in the national project relevant today, are there plans to revise the targets and to what levels?
— We understand that packages of sanctions restricting Russian exporters will appear further and we have no false expectations about mutual understanding with the authorities of "unfriendly countries" in the short term. Today we are actively rebuilding logistics chains, including along such routes as Russia – Turkey, Russia –China, North-South. Domestic companies need time to increase supplies to these countries and return to a stable growth of NNE.
Of course, there will be adjustments in the national project. We are currently developing a passport on the horizon until 2030. Initially, the weather targets were presented only until 2024. It is necessary to update both the overall timing and the pace of achieving the key indicator, which concerns the real growth of the NNE by at least 70% compared to the 2020 indicator. Work is underway to form a consolidated forecast of the development of the NNE until 2030, on the basis of which the values of the indicators of the national project will be updated.
— What are the prospects for the development of industrial software in Russia, in particular, CAD systems that are especially necessary for Russian enterprises?
— We have set a course to develop our own software product that can become a worthy competitor to the bygone foreign solutions.
By the beginning of 2025, according to the presidential decree, the key enterprises of the defense industry, metallurgy, chemical complex of our country - subjects of critical information infrastructure - should switch to using Russian software for all key functions.
To fulfill this task, we are preparing industrial competence centers for the replacement of imported software, including industrial software. Currently, more than 320 projects have been received from 161 industrial enterprises, work is underway to select the most promising software projects, problematic issues for each industry are being discussed. Already in August, the projects of industrial centers will be structured, supplemented with financial and economic justifications, and in September they must be selected by the government commission on digital development.
In addition, we are in the process of launching a Modular multiservice industrial platform that will combine all industrial software offers from Russian developers. The first services will be ready by the end of August, and their release will take place this September after comprehensive testing. Users will have access to a basic set of automated services, as well as the opportunity to receive additional expert support. The expanded version will be released later this year. It is important to emphasize that the ecosystem will be actively developed taking into account feedback from participants, including on the needs for missing software to form an order for the development of such software.
With the key partners of the ecosystem - Rostec, Rosatom, JSC "Russian Railways" - pilot projects are planned for digital business transformation and development of the client path for the introduction of engineering and industrial software from various suppliers: Top Systems, 1C, Ascon, Nanosoft, Tesis and others.
— When you came to the position of Deputy Prime Minister, you were assigned to oversee one of the most "industrial" federal districts - the Urals. What industries, enterprises of the Ural Federal District require increased attention, what is the reason for this?
— Last year, Mikhail Vladimirovich Mishustin approved a list of 25 major investment projects that are being implemented in the Ural Federal District. The projects cover a wide range of sectors of the economy – the construction of residential buildings, modern medical centers, industrial waste disposal, expansion of existing production facilities and the development of new production technologies.
In the new realities, the financial parameters of these projects, their technical conditions can be specified. Currently, work is underway to update this list, including plans to supplement it with new initiatives taking into account sanctions challenges. As the curator of the Ural Federal District, I set myself the goal of maximizing the potential of the region, so I plan to provide comprehensive support in their implementation.
Also in September, we plan to hold a Coordinating Council for Industry in the Khanty-Mansiysk District within the framework of the Yugra Industrial and Investment Forum. At such events, we discuss with regions and experts issues of improving state policy and regulatory regulation in the field of economic development of the country, exchange experience and strengthen interregional cooperation of regions, industrial enterprises and organizations. We pay special attention to promoting the development of industries in the regions, including the modernization of production facilities. Studying the experience of the Urals will be useful for other regions as well.
— When is it planned to start the construction of the Northern Latitudinal Passage, which was first postponed by redistributing the allocated funds, and then, on behalf of the president, decided to resume? What sources of project financing are being considered?
— On behalf of the President, it is planned to begin construction of the Northern Latitudinal Passage this year. I note that the project is just included in the list of investment projects of the Ural Federal District, which I mentioned earlier.
Indeed, last year it was planned to finance the project at the expense of an infrastructure budget loan to the government of the Yamalo-Nenets Autonomous Okrug, but at the beginning of this year it was decided to redistribute these IBC funds to support other priority and significant infrastructure projects.
Together with our colleagues, we have been working on alternative ways to finance the project. As of today, I can say that the allocation of over 70 billion rubles from the NWF for the construction of the Northern Latitudinal Passage has already been supported. However, these funds are not enough for the full implementation of the project, so we are working to find additional sources of funding.
It should be noted that the implementation of this major project is also important for the Russian metallurgical industry. After all, large-scale infrastructure construction projects stimulate the consumption of metal products within the country, allowing to compensate for the decline in exports.
