Tatarstan online BUSINESS Online edition under the headline "Vadim Korolev: "Tu-214 and MS-21 do not compete. We all have to deliver 600 civilian aircraft." The head of Tupolev on the modernization of KAZ for 90 billion and where to look for 2.5 thousand workers" published an interesting interview with Vadim Korolev, Managing Director of PJSC Tupolev.
Among what Korolev reported in an interview, it is worth noting that the new final assembly workshop currently under construction at the Kazan Aviation Plant, in which it is now planned to organize the assembly of Tu-214 aircraft, was originally built for the serial construction of promising PAK DA strategic bombers, which allows making pessimistic conclusions about the state of the PAK DA program.
A new final assembly workshop (c) under construction at the Kazan Aviation Plant named after S.P. Gobunov - a branch of PJSC Tupolev rais.tatarstan.ru
In a maximum of three years, KAZ should start building the Tu-214 on the principle of an automobile conveyor, therefore, the new modernization of the plant, which started in November, is being carried out according to an accelerated scheme. But when will the one that began in 2016 finally end? Which native of Kazan did the UAC appoint as the curator of Tupolev? Why is there still no promised money from the NWF, but only loans? How did the story about Aeroflot's comments on the appearance of the Tu-214 end? How are relations with fellow competitors from Yakovlev developing? Vadim Korolev, Managing Director of Tupolev, told BUSINESS Online about this in his first media interview.
In the 102nd year
By the early 2010s, the giant Tupolev was lying on its side. None of the new aircraft offered to them went into civilian transportation, including the Tu-334 and Tu-204SM that had already flown. The Tu-204 was discontinued, the production site in Ulyanovsk went to Ilyushin, and the Tu-214 was declared too expensive, and therefore suitable only for special aviation. Tupolev was no longer considered as a manufacturer of civilian aircraft - they relied on Superjet and MS-21. In the military segment, the company completed a couple of Tu-160 reserves, supported a fleet of strategists and long-range specialists. There was hope for the Tu-330 military transport project, but it also remained unclaimed.
Everything changed in 2015. The Russian leadership has decided to resume the construction of the Tu-160 - in the modernization of the Tu-160M, as well as to bring all existing machines to this level. In 2016, the Tu-22M3M project was launched, which had only been discussed before. They began to talk about the possible appearance of new military modifications of the Tu-214 - patrol and electronic warfare aircraft. The project of a promising long-range aviation complex was becoming more and more realistic. In 2016, modernization for military tasks of the Kazan Aircraft Factory - a branch of Tupolev (KAZ) started.
The intrigue in the civilian area has returned. The first hopes arose in connection with the appointment of Tatarstan President Rustam Minnikhanov as chairman of the Board of Directors of Tupolev in 2021. Earlier, he, like his predecessor as head of the republic, Mintimer Shaimiev, repeatedly expressed bewilderment at the fact that Tupolev and domestic aircraft were generally expelled from civil aviation.
By that time, Tupolev was becoming increasingly attached to Kazan, which was already the main production base of the company. In 2020, it became known that KAZ is preparing for the fullest possible volume of aircraft tests. There was talk of moving the company to the capital of the Republic of Tatarstan. Republican leaders have been talking about special rights to participate in the affairs of "Tu" for a long time - both in a veiled and quite openly. RT recalled that in the 90s, when everything was collapsing, the region did a lot to save KAZ. Sometimes it is said that this is a self-promotion by the authorities of Tatarstan, but the facts prove the opposite, and the correspondent of BUSINESS Online heard grateful statements addressed to the Republic of Tatarstan and from the old-timers of the Tupolev headquarters.
In the spring of 2022, after the cessation of supplies of imported aircraft to Russia, Minnikhanov had a chance to put his plans into action. The Russian government reacted positively to his proposal to resume production of the Tu-214 after a 15-year hiatus. The plans of Kazan and Tupolev were not accepted by everyone, but the visit of Russian Prime Minister Mikhail Mishustin to KAZ in June this year put an end to the "debate". He made it clear that the revival of the Tu-214 is not a whim of a single company or republic, but an urgent need. The thesis was supported by a promise to allocate 41.8 billion rubles from the National Welfare Fund and 42 billion borrowed for the program. However, the "struggle of ideas" continues, albeit in a more veiled form. But, anyway, a month ago, a new, now civilian, modernization of KAZ was launched. We are also talking about creating the next generation of the Tu-214.
Vadim Korolev is in charge of solving these tasks. He was appointed Managing Director of Tupolev in May 2021, and became the fifth head of the company in 10 years. Such a rapid change of leaders also says a lot about the former (hopefully) state of the "tupolev".
And recall that in October, Tupolev turned 101 years old.
When will the reconstruction of the KAZ be completed and why is there still no money from the NWF
- Vadim Vladimirovich, one modernization of the Kazan Aircraft Factory, the Tupolev branch (KAZ), has not yet been completed, as the second one began, for the construction of the Tu-214, new workshops were laid on November 9. Which of these programs is bigger?
- Modernization under the military-industrial program turned out to be long-term - it has been underway since 2016, so its scale may not be so visible, but in general they are comparable. Having completed both, we will get a new plant with completely different capabilities compared to the current ones. The program of reconstruction and re-equipment for the Tu-214 is, of course, ambitious in terms of time - 2-2.5, edge - 3 years, otherwise it will be problematic to reach the set production pace on time.
- When will the ongoing modernization be completed? This was planned to be done in 2020.
- The task is to ensure construction readiness this year, but one facility is likely to move to 2024. The deadlines are determined, among other things, by the structure of the work itself. At the initial stage, it was decided to deal with the reconstruction of existing areas as a priority, and then the construction of new ones. Meanwhile, this is an operating production, you can't close it, so all these years the contractors have been handing over the area to us in fragments, moving slower than they could.
- What kind of workshops are to be built for the Tu-214?
- The first is machining: more than 100 machining centers that will close almost the entire range of parts in this category for the Tu-214. The second one is an assembly plant, it will be attached to a huge final assembly workshop, which is being built today. We will get a complex with a production line according to the type of automobile conveyor. This principle has been implemented in Irkutsk for the assembly of the MS-21, in Ulyanovsk for the Il-76MD-90A and in Lukhovitsy for the Il-114-300. Due to the shortness of time, we are starting to build according to an accelerated scheme provided for by the regulatory framework and agreed at the government level.
- As far as I understand, the final assembly shop in question was intended for other machines...
- Yes, we have changed its purpose - it is completely given over to the Tu-214 program.
- It was announced that 41.8 billion rubles from the National Welfare Fund (NWF) will be allocated for it. Has the money started coming in?
- Now, at the first stage, financing is at the expense of credit funds.
- Will there be no money from the NWF?
- They will. We are charged with not reducing the pace of work, therefore, due to the time it takes to organize the receipt of NWF funds, the initial stage of financing is filled with loans. Then they will be compensated with NWF money. Let me remind you that in June, at a meeting with Russian Prime Minister Mikhail Mishustin, two stages of financing were discussed - the allocation of funds from the NWF and a bond loan.
- It was about a 42 billion loan. The result is almost 84 billion...
- Two programs have been combined: upon release from 2025, 10, and from 2027, 20 Tu-214 per year. In total, this is more than 90 billion.
- There is a feeling that the position of the second first deputy of the KLA, to which Konstantin Timofeev was appointed, was introduced primarily because of the transformation of KAZ ...
- I cannot comment on this assumption. Konstantin Petrovich was assigned the building block of the UAC, issues of strategic development of the corporation. And yes, he is the curator of Tupolev - this is logical, given that the new deputy director is from Tatarstan and, as I have seen, he is known in the republic.
- And, crucially, he is an aviation enthusiast and flies himself.
- I was struck by such a story. Once Rustam Nurgalievich (Minnikhanov - President of the Republic of Tatarstan - editor's note) asked him something about the Tu-214, and he replied that he did not know, and then, to find out, he studied for this type at the Ulyanovsk University of Civil Aviation and received a pilot's certificate.
What do the airlines want and has cooperation been built on Tu-214
- It is already clear that there are difficulties with the implementation of the forecast Tu-214 supply plan ...
- We are working hard, but there are delays. Firstly, it is not easy to accelerate because of the KAZ's bandwidth: previously, it made an average of one and a half Tu-214 per year, but now the task is to grow by an order of magnitude. Secondly, the scheme of bringing resources to scale production can be called unique, so the formation of appropriate rules took more time than originally expected. This affects the timing of technical re-equipment - both for us and, as far as I understand, for our cooperation. Now the necessary measures have been worked out, the money has gone.
- Which cars will you deliver in 2024?
- The first deliveries involve Tu-214 for Aeroflot and in a special version.
- The contract with Aeroflot for how many planes?
- Solid - by 11, and in total in the interests of the group - by 40, it is concluded with the leasing company Aviakapital-Service. Phased delivery is the rules of the most comprehensive program for the development of the Russian aviation industry until 2030. Today we signed a contract for 11, we receive advances, we start production, we deliver, then the next ones. We received an advance payment for the first five cars, launched the purchase of metal, and the production of parts through cooperation.
- Aeroflot has issued 99 points of comments on what needs to be changed in the passenger cabin. Will they be taken into account?
- Actually, there were no comments - a normal workflow. Aeroflot, taking into account its experience, said about additional wishes for the liner. Some of them are sent to us, and the other can be sold for the customer's money. The interior is coordinated. The overall technical appearance of the machines for Aeroflot has also been determined. The approach is flexible, since the Tu-214 has a good modernization potential. Only an agreement of intent for 10 cars has been signed with Yakutia Airlines, but we have already agreed on the requirements for the future contract, so as not to waste time later.
- Has the company "YUVT Aero" made any demands?
- No, there were only non-laborious moments that were coordinated on the go.
- How many Tu-214s are in production and at what stage is it? Is there something on the stocks?
- One is in the final assembly shop. For others, the work is at the stage of aggregate assembly, panel assembly. I would like to note that such works are launched for 4-5 machines.
- Has cooperation been built on the construction of the Tu-214?
- Contracts were signed with almost all partners even before receiving orders from carriers, the entire first tranche from airlines was given to cooperative enterprises. We have not left a penny for ourselves: we will spend from the second tranche for our own needs. The work is organized.
- Do you need to replace a lot of imports?
- no. For most of the components, development was not required, just small improvements are needed. But there are also elements in the development process.
- Is there any confidence that the UEC will be able to supply engines rhythmically?
- So far, colleagues have confirmed the delivery in the required volumes.
- Will the engines for the new Tu-214 be different from the current ones?
- No. The PS-90A has been worked out, and fellow engine engineers do not yet see the feasibility of serious improvements. Yes, you can make it a little more economical, add a little traction, but it's not worth the required investment. If remotorization is carried out in the future, then for completely new engines.
About the relationship with Irkut, the change of the chief designer of the Tu-214 and the move of Tupolev to Kazan
- In June, you announced firm contracts for 20 Tu-214s, agreements of intent for 67 aircraft and applications from potential customers for 61 aircraft. Can you name these real and potential customers?
- Firm contracts with commercial airlines are mentioned above. From the new one, cars appeared for the special flight detachment "Russia" (SLO) and other special customers. Then I was talking about 150 planes. We have calculated this until 2033, because we have programs that, in terms of implementation, go away by this year, and by 2030, the delivery of 115 aircraft.
- Are special vehicles counted for new construction or are we talking only about commercial vehicles?
- They count.
- In September, the media reported that the SLO will update the fleet, including the Tu-214 ...
- There is such a program, and for us it is an important part of the guaranteed demand for airplanes.
- According to known data, the Red Wings airline should receive two previously flown Tu-214. When will this happen?
- According to one of the boards, its owner, Ilyushin Finance Co. (IFK, part of the UAC - ed.), is completing the airworthiness restoration procedure and will soon transfer it to Red Wings. By the way, it was held in Kazan with the participation of the KAPO Avia company. The second Tu-214 UAC sees for some time as a flying laboratory for testing updated components. Then we plan to transfer the car to a commercial operator.
- Who will maintain and repair the Tu-214 new series?
- Any company certified for this type. Today it is KAPO Avia, KAZ, Tupolev Technician. But both Aeroflot and Ulyanovsk UZGA-Engineering want to get a certificate. The operator will choose where to fly for maintenance.
- How will the administrative incident be resolved with the fact that Tupolev produces civilian aircraft while remaining in the division of strategic and special aviation of the KLA? The stated scheme, in which the construction of aircraft is for Tu, and marketing, sales and after-sales services are controlled by Yakovlev, raises questions. The topic is particularly interesting due to the obvious rivalry between the Tu-214 and the MS-21.
- "Incident" is not the right word. Tupolev is the core of the UAC strategic Aviation division, in this part we have overambitious tasks and over-responsibility, and at the same time we are engaged in Tu-214. Yakovlev, as the basis of the civil aviation division, collects competencies for creating civilian products and managing their lifecycle, taking into account the requirements of commercial airlines. Today, carriers have about 160 Superjet. It took a lot of time and resources for colleagues to build an after-sales service system for them, and today it works. And by and large, it is logical to do things like the PPO platform not for each individual type, but for a line. And there is logic in the fact that today Andrey Ivanovich Boginsky, Deputy General Director of the UAC for Civil Aviation and General Director of Yakovlev, is leading the general direction of civil aviation. Moreover, the Tu-214 and MS-21 do not compete, but complement each other. Let me remind you that all of us together - both the UAC and the cooperation - will have to deliver 600 civilian aircraft by 2030. There is enough work and a place in the market for everyone.
- According to our data, there has been a change of the chief designer of the Tu-214 ...
- Igor Kabatov is an experienced man, he has spent many years working at Tupolev, he is our comrade. He had personal circumstances. Tupolev has a fairly strong design and production team. Continuity is not an empty word for us, so Igor's watch will be continued by another worthy person from our team. The decisions have already been made.
- Several times there was a conversation about the move of Tupolev to Kazan ...
- Various ideas were expressed. I remember such a story. When Rustam Nurgalievich was appointed chairman of the Board of Directors of Tupolev, he came to us for the first time. He had an hour and a half free, as a result, 6 hours showed him everything: both good and bad. He went to the window of Alexei Andreevich [Tupolev]'s office (Andrei Nikolaevich did not have time to visit this office), and there was a Yauza, a church. And then the bells rang. He says, "It's a sacred place, why leave here?"
About personnel policy, hope for the KNITU-KAI, toilets, locker rooms, canteens
- KAZu needs workers and engineers. I can't imagine where you'll find them, especially the main production workers...
- It's not an easy task. We really hope for Kazan educational institutions, although it is clear that the market in the republic is very competitive: we, the KVZ, the UZGA division, and the Zelenodolsk Shipbuilding, not to mention other industries - delivery, logistics, trade. We are building relationships with universities. Like other UAC enterprises, we have a targeted training program at KNITU-KAI, MAI, Bauman Moscow State Technical University, and the Moscow Energy Institute. But today we are more interested in Kazan, because people are needed primarily at KAZ. This year, the KNITU-KAI department was opened at the plant. Yes, the targets are a small part, but I'm sure they're just the beginning. It is hardly worth counting on the CES for the regions of Russia, but we are preparing such a program for a number of areas. In the next three years, it is necessary to additionally find at least 2.5 thousand basic production workers.
- What will you use to lure?
- First of all, the salary. There are positive changes in this area. There is a directive requirement from Rostec and the UAC that the average salary at the plant be 10 percent higher than the average for the city. It's hard to do it at once, we go in stages. I see the remuneration of certain categories of employees as clearly unfair, we will equalize, somewhere even point-by-point.
We intend to attract them with housing. We work with the State Housing Fund of Tatarstan, there is a quota in the Salavat Kupere area. I agree, it's not a very convenient place, but you have to start somewhere. As of today, 10 families have joined the rental housing program - the company compensates for 50 percent. Mortgage lending programs have appeared, which previously were only in Moscow and Zhukovsky: we compensate for half the interest rate, but the person undertakes to work with us for at least a certain period. A fairly strict story: if he leaves early, he returns the money that the company paid for him, and we have already done this a couple of times. But everything is fair, why there is a queue for these programs.
We are engaged in landscaping. It is necessary that workers stop feeling like they are in a permanent construction site. People need simple things - renovated toilets, changing rooms, a good dining room. By the way, we have greatly improved the quality of food over the year - we have found normal contractors.
The personnel problem was discussed at a recent meeting of the Board of Directors of Tupolev. A working group has been formed to solve it. Now we are writing a program for attracting and retaining staff, we will roll it out at the level of Rustam Nurgalievich by the end of the year, and we will start working.
- Will Tupolev be a partner of KNITU-KAI in the program of advanced engineering schools?
- At the same board of directors, we received approval to participate in the project. In fact, we have a non-material contribution to the co-financing of the program: these are all costs for the target audience, the department, the practice and other assistance that we can provide to the institute.
About the next generation of the Tu-214, the Tu-204SM program and the fate of the Tu-334
- The General Director of the UAC, Yuri Slyusar, announced that a proposal is being formed to create the next generation of the Tu-214. What does this mean?
- We have such a proposal. The first direction is the creation of an aircraft for a two-member crew. It should be tested in 2026. But we will also keep cars with two pilots and a flight engineer: the military, special services require at least a three-member crew… The second direction is the creation of a short version of the Tu-204-300 type. It may turn out to be an effective aircraft for long-shoulder flights of the Moscow - Vladivostok type… And the third direction is a cargo plane. We are launching this story on an initiative basis - we want to have something to show when the time comes. The truck is potentially in great demand, for example, we have an application from one airline that would take 10 boards at least now.
- Tupolev has already created an aircraft with a two-member crew - the Tu-204SM. To put it simply, is it possible to take and transfer this cabin to the Tu-214?
- The Tu-204SM received a type certificate 13 years ago, it was a breakthrough, but today that complex of on-board equipment is outdated. Let me remind you, then they decided to "shoot" a super-good product - they started the MS-21 program, a lot - about 80 employees of Tupolev who were engaged in SM transferred to Irkut (today renamed Yakovlev - ed.). As a result, it turned out that the control system for general aircraft equipment, which made it possible to implement the binomial principle on the CM, was developed in the MS-21, and today, in fact, we take it and twist it for ourselves.
- What will happen to the two Tu-204SM in storage?
- They belong to the Ulyanovsk Aircraft Factory. There is an interested party who is ready to buy them out and restore them for operation.
- At one time, KAZ had high hopes that he would be entrusted with the construction of the Tu-330 military transport. Is the topic closed?
- Today, yes. We are focused on the implementation of strategic, special and civil aviation tasks.
- A few years ago, they were quite officially talking about military modifications of the Tu-214 ...
- The plane has such a future.
- Also, information has repeatedly surfaced in the press that a contract is about to be signed with Tupolev for the modernization of 30 Tu-22M3 to the Tu-22M3M standard ...
- So far, we are talking about several aircraft, but we understand how and in what time frame, when setting the appropriate task, to modernize the existing fleet.
- There is still an experienced Tu-334 on KAZ. What's going to happen to him?
- In the design, the Tu-334 is an excellent car, but at one time it was not brought to the series. I am one of the few who flew it as a service passenger, including 15 years ago, when we demonstrated it at Kazan airport to the staff of Tatarstan Airlines. Then they took her chief pilot and senior flight engineer with them to Zhukovsky and gave them control. It was a very good impression… We will definitely save the car standing at the factory, we will not let it be scrapped.
Timur Latypov
Managing Director of PJSC Tupolev Vadim Korolev (c) PJSC Tupolev